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Author Topic: Dating some teacups  (Read 1803 times)
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MrsPeebles
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« Reply #20 on: July 31, 2011, 07:49:58 AM »

Elaine,
I like the cobalt set best. I don't think of it as a flow-blue, but I was say that it likely is mid-century and suitable for LH. Dating it is tough because you see that blue sell well into the ate 1870s. The other ironstone with the gold decoration made me think of "tea leaf" knockoff patterns. Both have intersting handles, but I must say, that cobalt blue really talks to me, it's a sweet set.

The ironstone, it could fit in anytime from 1850 onward as the beauty of that style was universal. Any store could sell ironstone, and with little additions and decorations like you show here, it would be simple for anyone to slip a few cups like this onto the breakfast table without mixing up table patterns too drastically. In other words, if you have various sets of ironstone, changing out a few sets of ironstone with different decorations wouldn't have been unusual, and it was a cheap way to stretch a table pattern for a few more years.
Another thought too, it was common for folks to take worn dishes to a china mender. When the glaze gets worn on a dish, you could take them in, have cracks and paint mended, and the whole lot reglazed. Often, some folks took in parts of their ironstone for the same purpose,  or simply update to a more modern pattern, consequently if your set doesn't have a hallmark on the bottom, it might have been a set done by a private artist or small business.
I hope that I've helped you some Elaine. A happy summer to you. Cheesy
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Elaine M
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« Reply #21 on: August 04, 2011, 04:40:58 PM »

Thanks so much for your help, Mrs. Peebles!  It's one of the things I love about this kind of forum - getting to learn from the expertise of others. 

It's the finer points that usually trip me up - I picked up both sets not knowing how well they fit the time period.  I was working off of the high-cupped saucer and handle shape.  It's the details of patterns and colors that are difficult to track down.  If I know the pattern, it's fine, but when I don't, which is the majority of the time....it gets messy.

Based on your previous comments, I think I'd be safe in saying the blue set is a breakfast set?  It doesn't have any type of depression for the cup - just looks like a smooth shallow bowl.   I found that detail fascinating and had no idea it would denote breakfast. 

Elaine Smiley
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Marta Vincent
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« Reply #22 on: August 05, 2011, 06:31:43 AM »

Elaine, The blue one is definitely not Flow blue, and both of them are good to use for the period.  I also think they might be a bit later than the '60's, but the shape of cup and handle and the nice deep saucer say middle 19th c.  If there are no markings, then they likely date before that '90's/TOC-ish law that made mfg-ers mark them "made in...".

The white one actually could be copper lustre transferware if that is a coppery color rather than gold.
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Elaine M
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« Reply #23 on: August 05, 2011, 06:02:40 PM »

Marta, there are no markings on any of them.  Copper rather than gold?  hmmm - I'll have to take them out in the sun and look.  Inside the color changes based on the light.  They also have purple lines with them, which I don't believe showed up in the photo. 

I think the only reason I was thinking "flow blue" was because there was over run on the blue, but that may have been an illogical conclusion.  It could also just be a bit of extra glaze. 
I really like learning more about china but not enough to devote the time I would need to be an expert! Cheesy

Since I still wear only cotton wash dresses, I would agree that these are both fancier than I would use...but they're pretty darn fun to have and figure out!

Elaine
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Marta Vincent
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« Reply #24 on: August 06, 2011, 08:04:28 AM »

Elaine, Transferware was "everyday dishes" in middle class households in the 1860's.  White stoneware would be "kitchen table" dishes, and common in lower class - middle class households.  So you should be able to use either.

If someone asks why you are using such a fancy cup, say that this is part of your set of better dishes. Now, the set has many missing pieces but you cherish what you have left and choose to use them because the teacup reminds you that you are still a lady.

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E L Watkins-Morris
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« Reply #25 on: May 28, 2012, 04:09:21 AM »

Is there a "definitive" print resource on 19th china out there? Or, rather, one or two that are good starting points.

Trying to narrow down my potential resources and am inundated with a whole lot of maybes.

Thank you,
Liz W.
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Stephanie Brennan
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« Reply #26 on: May 28, 2012, 04:37:39 AM »

  Liz-  I would go by shape more than the design on the teacup.  There were numerous patterns but basic shapes and style of handle are more distinctive for a teacup of this period.      Stephanie
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E L Watkins-Morris
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« Reply #27 on: May 28, 2012, 06:01:30 AM »

Good point, Stephanie, as that is actually the type of guidance I am looking for.


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Materium Superbat Opus-Ovid
Simple yet complex...-Mark Baldridge, Art 101: The Principles of Design
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