Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Dotted Swiss Dress  (Read 5110 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Michaela C
Frequent Scribbler
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 149


WWW
« on: June 18, 2014, 02:34:18 PM »

I've been contemplating making my almost-12-year-old sister a white dotted-swiss dress with some curtains that are still in good condition. For her age, is two panels of 54'' enough?
Any other suggestions? I like the idea of making a colored Swiss waist to go with it. Were Swiss waists ever colored? And what fabric where they made out of?
Logged

My soul is fed with needle and thread!
Michaela C
Frequent Scribbler
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 149


WWW
« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2014, 02:44:36 PM »

Oh, if anyone knows of any originals or photos of something like this, could you post them?
Logged

My soul is fed with needle and thread!
Paula
Scribblor Infinitus
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1529



« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2014, 03:17:38 PM »

First, and you probably already have thought of this, make sure your curtains are 100% natural fiber.  Second is the dotted swiss white dots on white fabric?

Two panels of 54" is going to give you skirts of 102" How big is her cage?   102" may look "skimpy" if her cage is on the larger size.  The question of if it will be enough fabric will depend on the type of bodice and sleeves you are going to use and how much fabric you are going to need for the skirt lengths.

I'll let someone else answer the swiss waist color question since I haven't spent a lot of time researching Swiss waists.   They tend to be more "high fashion" then my typical persona. I do know that they are typically made of silk. 

There are also six pages that come up when you do a search for Swiss Waist on this forum so you may find some help that way too.
Logged
EKorsmo
Dedicated Scribbler
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 476



WWW
« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2014, 03:31:18 PM »

I understand silk (taffeta) to be the most common material, though the first link here has one described as "cotton sateen", and the Peterson's description mentions velvet.  Lots of original swiss waists on-line, in a variety of colors:

http://www.koshka-the-cat.com/swiss.html

http://www.thegracefullady.com/civilwargowns/originals_swisswaists.htm

From Peterson's (Fashions for May, 1860):
"Fig. II Dress of thin white Muslin. The skirt is plain but relieved by the broad ends of black velvet which fall from the waist. A Swiss body of black velvet is cut quite low and above it is a white puffed body gathered length-wise and between each puff is a row of narrow black velvet. Short sleeves with three puffs."

From "Together: A Novel" (1865):
"...so the next Wednesday I put on my black silk skirt and white Swiss waist and went to Mrs Linnard's..."

From Godey's (Novelties for August, 1862):
"Daisy Waist: Full lace waist separated into puffs by insertion through which narrow ribbon or velvet is run. Full sleeves puffed at the top and at the wrist. Swiss bodice of silk bordered with plain velvet. Shoulder straps of velvet with shoulder knot and ends. A charming waist for a young lady worn with a rich skirt either in silk or thin material such as bar?ge or grenadine."

(Picture included: http://books.google.com/books?id=kFw2AQAAMAAJ&pg=PA184&dq=swiss+waist&hl=en&sa=X&ei=pQ-iU9i4EJbqoAT9u4CoDw&ved=0CDMQ6AEwAzgU#v=onepage&q=swiss%20waist&f=false)

From Peterson's (April, 1864)
"The Swiss bodice and various ceintures of which we have often spoken are also much worn by little girls over white dresses with large bows and flowing ends at the back. "  

And some more pretties: http://ornamentedbeing.tumblr.com/image/4826974052
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-xndgHkrrxU4/UTOyvLZ_F1I/AAAAAAAAD0k/JWkpvRHDJi4/s1600/1861+blouse+skirt+swiss+belt.jpg



Logged

Michaela C
Frequent Scribbler
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 149


WWW
« Reply #4 on: June 19, 2014, 10:58:27 AM »

Thank you ladies!
I actually did not think to check it is a natural fiber; I will be sure to do that.
Yes, it is white-on-white dotted.
In terms of skirt fullness, she does not have a hoop, she prefers not to wear one. I still need to make her a petticoat or two.
Thank you on the info for swiss waists; that is really helpful!
What different kinds of necklines are there for this style? I'm having a really hard time finding photos.
Logged

My soul is fed with needle and thread!
Paula
Scribblor Infinitus
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1529



« Reply #5 on: June 19, 2014, 11:03:42 AM »

If she's not willing to wear a cage then I would skip the Swiss waist.  A Swiss waist is a high fashion item and needs all the foundation garments and accessories that signify high fashion.
Logged
Paula
Scribblor Infinitus
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1529



« Reply #6 on: June 19, 2014, 12:19:30 PM »

Here are a few teen dresses that might work with your fabric.  Again you are first going to want to check to make sure it is 100% natural fiber

http://www.thegracefullady.com/civilwargowns/images/originalgarments/sheergowns/sheer_1.jpg


http://www.thegracefullady.com/civilwargowns/images/cdvs/children/teengirl.jpg
« Last Edit: June 19, 2014, 12:22:51 PM by Paula » Logged
Michaela C
Frequent Scribbler
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 149


WWW
« Reply #7 on: June 19, 2014, 01:25:22 PM »

Is a silk belt/sash quite the same thing?
Logged

My soul is fed with needle and thread!
Michaela C
Frequent Scribbler
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 149


WWW
« Reply #8 on: June 19, 2014, 02:10:20 PM »

Oh, and if I were to buy a hoop skirt for her, where would I find one? And how do I determine what the circumference should be?
Logged

My soul is fed with needle and thread!
EKorsmo
Dedicated Scribbler
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 476



WWW
« Reply #9 on: June 19, 2014, 02:45:39 PM »

I'm not sure what you're asking, exactly (but will take a stab at it while awaiting the experts):  

Swiss waists/waistbands/bodices/bodies, sashes, and belts all fit the same niche: decorative things worn at the waist over a dress or skirt/bodice outfit.  There seems to be a fair amount of ambiguity in the terms, at least in modern use--I've heard 'swiss waist' used to described everything from a belt-like-garment with points at the front, up to a low-cut bodice worn as an accessory (and which covers most of the bodice it is being worn over).  Looking at period images (specifically "The Way They Were" vol I & II), several types of decorative waist ornaments are visible: straight bands/belts with buckles or bows; similar 'belts' with points; narrow bands with large bows and trailing streamers; and pointed, bodice-like garments which go from the waist up to the under-bust or bust level.  

From period reading, there seems to be some distinction between sashes and the 'Swiss' garments, but they fulfill the same roles:

"The Russian, Swiss and Medici Waistbands are worn more than ever. Some are plain, some stitched in colored silk, others embroidered with silk braid, etc. The long sashes tied at the side, and generally black, are also embroidered with a design to match the dress they accompany. These sashes, edged with a fluting or a row of lace, with braces and pocket trimmings to match, are in great vogue and, especially when adopted to muslin chemisettes, are extremely pretty for very young ladies." Peterson's, March 1862

"The most fashionable sashes have a wide band, a large rosette on one side, and long lapels finished off with fringe. The pointed Swiss band, however, is still worn as well as a great variety of bands, sashes and low bodices." Peterson's, August 1865

As far as I can tell, the differences go something like this:

Belt = structured garment worn at the waist; may be straight or pointed

Swiss waist= structured garment worn at the waist; noted for it's points; may be cut low (similar to a belt) or high (similar to a low bodice)

Sash= structured garment worn at the waist; noted for it's hanging/flowing edges; may feature a bow

If I've made a mistake or over-simplification, I would be grateful for correction.


P.S., In regards hoops: this threads may be useful: http://thesewingacademy.org/index.php?topic=9909.msg135572#msg135572 http://thesewingacademy.org/index.php?topic=9842.0
For hoops:  http://shop.originals-by-kay.com/product.sc?productId=472&categoryId=-1
For hoop kits: http://www.woodedhamlet.com/costume_accessories/CagedCrino.htm
http://shop.originals-by-kay.com/product.sc?productId=1328&categoryId=34
For supplies: https://www.farthingalescorsetmakingsupplies.com/products.php?cat=hoopsteel
http://corsetmaking.com/category/hoop-boning.html (warning: I bought the buckram-covered steel here, and it started splitting before I even opened the box).
Logged

Elizabeth
Administrator
Scribblor Infinitus
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7894


WWW
« Reply #10 on: June 19, 2014, 04:53:42 PM »

Good information shared above!

The Swiss waist/white-bodice combinations are *definitely* a higher-fashion item, so she'll need to have all the appropriate underlayers, including something supportive for her torso, and a hoop or cage.

I'm afraid the amount of dotted fabric you have will be skimpy for a dress, or even just a skirt.

Once she has the underlayers, including a cage, and IF your impressions would make good use of a higher-fashion item, and IF the dotted fabric is all-cotton and in excellent shape, then I'd say:

Use a colored silk for skirts
Use the dotted fabric for a semi-sheer white bodice
Use a deep-colored silk for a structured belt, "Swiss waist", corselet, sash, or something else that's built over good period foundations and charming.

She'll also want good white stockings and tidy shoes... nothing rough, everything very well-shined and pleasant.

It can be a gorgeous look, but all the pieces have to harmonize.
Logged

Regards,
Elizabeth
Michaela C
Frequent Scribbler
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 149


WWW
« Reply #11 on: June 19, 2014, 05:54:35 PM »

All of this sort of depends on whether or not the dotted swiss at Joanns is the same (same dot size).
Thank you ladies for the great suggestions and info! If I end up following through, it may not be for a while.
Logged

My soul is fed with needle and thread!
Elizabeth
Administrator
Scribblor Infinitus
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7894


WWW
« Reply #12 on: June 20, 2014, 12:15:49 PM »

Some projects take time to gel. I *finally* cut into a piece of fabric I've had for 12-15 years, because it finally decided it wanted to be a wrapper. It's okay to take time to develop things! Cheesy
Logged

Regards,
Elizabeth
Michaela C
Frequent Scribbler
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 149


WWW
« Reply #13 on: July 08, 2014, 04:01:44 PM »

I've decided against the dotted swiss, but a sheer (after she has all the right undergarments) may be in the future. Does anyone have any pictures of girls in sheer dresses or originals? I have looked everywhere, but can only find adult dresses.

Oh, and by the way, one of the reasons I joined this forum is everyone is sooooo nice. I have been on some of the pages on Facebook, but all the ladies can't seem to agree on things that seem like they should be correct or not.
Logged

My soul is fed with needle and thread!
EKorsmo
Dedicated Scribbler
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 476



WWW
« Reply #14 on: July 08, 2014, 08:04:41 PM »

There's a few young ladies in the CDVS at The Graceful Lady: http://www.thegracefullady.com/civilwargowns/cdvs_sheergowns.htm
Logged

Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines